Anyanka said

Boleyn said

Sharon said

Personal opinion here, but I think Dereham probably did say he was going to marry Katherine when the king died. He doesn’t strike me as being a very bright bulb. He underestimated Henry as so many others did. I doubt very much that he thought his words would get back to Henry. Katherine and him were a great pair.

I agree Sharon, why go to all the trouble of getting a letter from the Duchess (How or why he did this is open to debate, but i’m inclined to think that he may have blackmailed the Duchess somehow, perhaps he threatened to her stepson or others about the way she ran her household) to get a place in K.H’s household, just for the sheer hell of it. I strongly believe that he felt he could simply pick up where he left off with her and no one would be none the wiser.
He did underestimate Henry that’s true, but he also underestimated K.H. When Dereham went off on his travels, he believed she would wait for him. unfortunatly for him like most giggy teenagers, she simply moved on to her next love affair, Henry. I don’t think she ever loved Henry in the way he wanted her to, but saw him more as a sugar daddy if that makes sence. Dereham must have felt very recentful towards Henry, but instead of keeping his mouth shut he opened it in the wrong place and as a result not only did it land him in the bullplop landed the whole Howard clan in it too right up to their necks.

Bragging about former conquests ..especially when you have the video tape..is the modern day equivalent ..

Dereham was a braggart .For me..he thought seducing KH was the Golden Ticket to power only to discover he was dumped in favour of KH going to court..Once she was queen , he tried to blackmail her into ..what..keep him quiet?resume his affair??

What happened was a whole boat load of fecal matter once Mary Lascells confessed to her brother..

True, but then one wonders what Mary Lascells was hoping to get from dropping the Howard Clan in it? Am I right in thinking that her brother was burned at the stake, just a few years later? Did Mary take any part in the bedtime fun.?
Dereham was a bombastic braggard, and I rather think that K.H may have been a little afraid of him (loosely worded). Certainly at first K.H probably found him exciting, but I believe that over time he became perhaps a little overbearing, so when he bogged off to Ireland, she was perhaps glad to see the back of him. That’s my thinking anyway.
I still don’t understand the Duchess’s reasoning for giving him the letter? Surely she must have realised that K.H and Dereham, were a little overfreindly, after all she did catch them together and give them a hiding for their in-appropiate behaviour. So wouldn’t she want to a make sure that would never happen again? especially since poor K.H was now manacled to the most powerful man in the Kingdom.

Sharon said

John Laselles was burned at the stake at the same time Anne Askew was. July of 1546. It was John who decided to turn on the Howard clan. While visiting her brother, Mary had gossiped about the goings on at the Duchess’ home, but it was John who went to Cranmer and blabbed. He did it for religious reasons and wanted the Catholic Howard family brought to their knees. Mary did not participate in the dormitory exploits. She was a servant there.
I think the Duchess was charmed by Dereham. She probably thought the romance between him and Katherine was over and done with. I’m sure she never thought for a minute that he would brag about his affair with Katherine or say the stupid comment about marrying her. He must have assured the Duchess that he just wanted a job and nothing more from Katherine.

That would make sence I suppose. But the duchess surely must have been aware of the type of person he was, and that he wasn’t one who could keep his gob shut about such a thing as having sex with Katherine? I rather think that if K.H had perhaps kept her so called affair with Culpepper a little more discreet he wouldn’t have blabbed so loudly. I still feel that he felt he could still have his bedroom privilages with K.H and that they would marry once lard arse popped his clogs, and that her so called affair with Culpepper put his nose out of joint, and he was jealous.
He perhaps tolerated Henry after all he was an old, and not in the best of health, so I guess he thought give it 6 months and the fat git will be deadand I’ll be able to marry her. It was only after K.H showed preference for Culpepper that he got really miffed as he saw Culpepper as an fly in his K.H oinkment. Dereham I think was insanely in love with K.H, and willing to risk everything if only he could have her all to himself., Blabbing like he did was not only reckless but suicide, and I think he knew that but by then I think it was a case of “well if I can’t have no one else will either” and I feel that was shadowed by Henry when he found out what she had been up to.

Video worked great. How KOOL is that. ty for the link.