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Thomas Wyatt
March 8, 2014
11:52 pm
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Anyanka
La Belle Province
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Rather than hijack this thread(http://www.theanneboleynfiles……wives/why/) any more..

In Josephine Wilkinson book The Early Loves of Anne Boleyn, she mentions that in the Chronicle of King Henry VIII of England, Wyatt attempted to seduce Anne but was distrubed on that night but was allowed into her bed a week later( pages 81-82).

Hapsfield who wrote A Treatise on the Pretend Divorce during MAry’s reign again uses Wyatt to balcken Anne by having him tell Henry not to marry Anne due to her loose morals.

Sander then builds on these stories in his The Rise and Growth of the English Schism to imagine Wyatt as Anne’s lover who denounced Anne to the council while Henry was publicly announcing Anne as a virtous woman.

Did Anne have any kind of romantic relationship with Wyatt? Or was it a one-way poet/muse/courtly love which died a natural death once Henry had made it clear she was his next wife?

It's always bunnies.

March 9, 2014
8:29 am
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Boleyn
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I found Thomas Wyatt a very confusing person, whilst he professes to be madly in love with her, and wrote many poems alledgely professing his love her they seems very resentful and bitter.
As for a relationship between them, it’s kind of like the same type of thing that Culpepper and K.H had, a did they or didn’t they have sex.
Personally I think not, the reason being because Anne had made it clear to Lard Arse when she first drew his attention that she would never become his mistress. If he wanted her he had to marry her. So I find it highly unlikely that she would be Wyatt’s wh*re, as he himself was married too.

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

March 10, 2014
3:05 am
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Anyanka
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No. I don’t think it was anything more than a poet/muse relationship..

If all Henry as king could offer was being his mistress with an upgrade to maitresse-en-titre when Anne refused the first few times..

Then a married nobleman who was known to have a wondering…..one-eyed snake whose wife was equally reknowned as a lady of pleasure was never a catch for some-one like Anne who knew her value on the marriage market.

It's always bunnies.

March 11, 2014
4:56 pm
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Sharon
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Exactly! Anne wanted marriage. If Anne refused to become Henry’s maitresse-en-titre because it wasn’t good enough, why would she bother to give herself to another married man who offered her less.

March 19, 2014
2:32 am
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Olga
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Henry never accused Anne of coming to the marriage bed unchaste did he? I would have thought if he knew that (and after a seven year engagement he would have) then he would have used it against her later.
I keep meaning to read that book Anyanka, how is it?

March 19, 2014
11:45 am
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Boleyn
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Olga I’m not too sure about this but I believe Henry did accuse Anne of not being a virgin when they first bedded/married, when he decided to chop her up. I kind of get the opinion this was the reason why Wyatt was chucked in the Tower along with everyone else. I think H8 was trying to prove that Anne may have slept with Wyatt at some point whilst H8 and she were courting. A sence of Deja vu there me thinks.

Got to admit H8 like to play the no virgin when married card didn’t he? Tried to prove COA was no virgin when they married during the fiasco divorce trial. May have worked in 1512, when he first got the jitters about their marriage, but to try and use the no virgin card 28 years down the line was just extracting the urine big time.
Then if I am right in thinking trying to use the same card again to prove that Anne was no virgin due to her hiding playing hide the sausage with Wyatt, before H8. Henry Percy’s wife also accused Anne of playing hide the sausage, with Percy. Therefore saying that Anne and Percy were precontracted, but I think her claims were dismissed, due to the fact of sour grapes on her part.

After J.S came AOC, who again Henry played the Not Virgin card. Basically he based his whole case on the fact that her breasts and belly were loose and out of sorts I believe he termed her body. Bye Bye Anne don’t let the door hit you in the bum on the way out.
K.H his “rose without a thorn” I think he did truly believe that she was an innocent rose, so the old not virgin card in this case was played by Cranmer. But even so H8 was devestated when he found out that the woman he believed so pure and innocent wasn’t the person he thought she was. I still think that her death and A.B death were among one of the biggest travesties of Justice England has ever known. Even KOA fiasco divorce trial which was bad enough, didn’t top H8 chopping sprees.
K.H had been foolish, and had made mistakes, but hey don’t all teens screw up, but she DID NOT deserve to die. She was a sweet and loving girl who perhaps was a little too trusting which led to ambitious people to take advantage of her i.e the biggest arsehole on the planet at that time (Henry), next to him of course was that odious little cretinious poppingjay Uncle Norfolk. You have all read my theory on why H8 chopped her up, so I needn’t say it again, lets just say vanity and ego featured big time where H8 was concerned.
K.P well H8 would have known that with 2 husbands before him the chances are that K.P was no virgin, I think it’s reasonable to say 50/50 on being a virgin. Did H8 and K.P have sex? Again i’m not to sure about this but somewhere I’ve read that in H8 will he had made provision for any child that K.P would have if she was found to be pregnant after he had kicked the barrel (Yeah I know it’s bucket, but the size of his guts he would be able to see the bucket lets alone kick it.) I think it read something like this Throne to go to Eddy and his heirs, if any. Then Mary and her heirs, if any, and lastly to Elizabeth and her heirs if any. However should the Queen prove to be with child after my death, her child if a son will be placed before Mary and Elizabeth, if Eddy dies with heirs. If it be a girl then that child will be placed in line directly after Elizabeth if she dies without heirs.

Either way i’m digressing her (nothing new) the fact is that H8 knew how to play the NO virgin card, as well as the poor bleeding martyr cards to the maximum affect. Personally if you take those cards out of the equation and look at it logically H8 was was spiteful vindictive and callous piece of s**t.

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

March 21, 2014
12:13 am
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Anyanka
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Olga said

Henry never accused Anne of coming to the marriage bed unchaste did he? I would have thought if he knew that (and after a seven year engagement he would have) then he would have used it against her later.
I keep meaning to read that book Anyanka, how is it?

IIRC, he said that she had “been meddled with in France” but didn’t accuse her of being unchaste. I’m under the impression that Anne had different ideas of foreplay and the like which Henry didn’t understand.

Olga, it’s not a bad book as it looks at a period of Anne’s life which is generally overlooked, her early years at court when she was the newly arrived and exotic lady-in-waiting who attracted several men before the king himself fell in love with her.

It's always bunnies.

March 21, 2014
5:48 am
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Boleyn
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I suppose H8 thought that due to Mary Boleyn’s “supposed” relationship with Francois the so called “English Mare” H8 was trying to say that if Mary B could allow herself to be used in such a manner there is no reason to think that Anne was any different.

There is a major flaw in H8 accusation, there is no proof about Mary having a relationship with Francois. The whole affair accusation is based on hearsay.

Francois and Henry were 2 bulls trying to outdo each other when ever they could.
How better for Francois to get one over Henry by calling Mary B his English mare, thus meaning I can s*** any woman I like be they French or English etc.
I’ll have to invest in this book. I wonder how Anne felt about life in the English Court after the twitterings of the French and Burgundy courts. She must have found the English court staid and rather dull. I suppose you can understand why she became such an attraction. She must have shone out like a beacon. Or to use a better saying she must have stood out like a sore thumb.

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

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