Of all the inaccuracies... | Page 3 | The Tudors Show | Forum

Avatar

Please consider registering
guest

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —




— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

No permission to create posts
sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_TopicIcon
Of all the inaccuracies...
March 15, 2012
12:39 pm
Avatar
Sharon
Binghamton, NY
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2115
Member Since:
February 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I’ve just refreshed my memory, (Changed the rabbits in my head that are working the controls), about this topic, and there are certainly some very interesting points of view..
Is it just possible perhaps that Wolsey did actually commit suicide in real life? as it seemed strange that when he was dismissed from his post etc, and then arrained of charges of Praemunire, and would have lost his life anyway, at least dying on his way back to London would have saved his families reputation, as his mistress and children could have at least have got something out of his death. If he had been burned or beheaded I think Henry would have just had him beheaded, his family would have lost everything. I’m not saying he slit his throat as that would have meant that whoever found his body would have recorded that his throat had been slit, and I don’t think for one minute that anyone one within the monastic grounds would have done it as the reformation hadn’t got into full swing and perhaps wouldn’t have done if Wolsey had lived. So therefore Wolsey would have damned his soul, by killing himself. But what if he poisoned himself? no one would be none the wiser, they simple would have put his death down to natural causes which of course it was recorded as. His death would have been mourned and the suitable masses would be said for his soul etc.
*******************************************************************************************************************
I guess it is possible that Wolsey either killed himself or was killed. There was certainly one person who thought so. I went to L&P and found this from our friend and gossip columnist, Chapuys:
Eight days ago the King gave orders for the Cardinal to be brought here; on which the Cardinal remained for some days without food, hoping rather to finish his life in this way than in a more shameful one, of which he had some fears. He has been taken ill on the road, and has not arrived.

From: ‘Henry VIII: November 1530, 21-30’, Letters and Papers, Foreign and Domestic, Henry VIII, Volume 4: 1524-1530 (1875), pp. 3032-3052. URL: http://www.british-history.ac……mpid=91410
And this:
The cardinal of York died on St. Andrew’s Day, at a place where king Richard was killed. They are both buried in the same church, which the people call The Tyrants’ Sepulchre. At first the Cardinal refused to take nourishment; afterwards he took or was given something to hasten his end. On Monday the captain of the guard arrived to conduct him hither. Soon afterwards he was taken ill, lingered till Wednesday, and then prepared for his end like a good Christian. On taking the sacrament he protested he had never done anything to the prejudice of his Sovereign. The King still retains his benefices. London, 4 Dec. 1530.

From: ‘Henry VIII: December 1530, 1-14’, Letters and Papers, Foreign and Domestic, Henry VIII, Volume 4: 1524-1530 (1875), pp. 3052-3058. URL: http://www.british-history.ac……mpid=91411

May 25, 2012
12:53 pm
Avatar
Lynda
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 4
Member Since:
May 23, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I guess for me was, amongst the ones mentioned on this thread previously, the way they had Katherine Howard behaving. I don’t believe for a minute a Queen of England (however young) would have giggled and flirted and simpered like that. She would have held herself completely differently. Also I know it was just a drama but nobody would have looked so glamorous or sexy all the time!!! The hairstyles were a bit too “now” Smileand there wouldn’t have been as much make-up. But I don’t hold that against the show because I absolutely loved it.Smile

May 25, 2012
3:01 pm
Avatar
Boleyn
Kent.
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2285
Member Since:
January 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

The only person who has come close to playing the K.H we know is Emily Blunt. K.H was flightly and did some stupid things, but she wasn’t a bad girl in real life, just misguided perhaps.. But then don’t all teenagers make mistakes?

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

May 27, 2012
4:54 am
Avatar
Janet
ON Canada
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 153
Member Since:
February 24, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I’ve chased the Wolsey suicide idea around in my own head quite a few times. It seems rather convenient that he died en route to what would be a very nasty end. If he had stopped eating and was weak, it wouldn’t take much of something to end his life. Perhaps someone close to him thought they were doing him a favour by saving him from facing such a terrible ordeal. I can’t see Wolsey doing it himself, but I can see him planting the idea in someone’s head.

I loved Emily Blunt’s KH. The nude chopping block in The Tudors makes me laugh. It was February and that poor girl would have been darn cold being naked. Laugh

May 27, 2012
10:12 am
Avatar
Gellygret
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 26
Member Since:
May 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Yes defintiely a few inaccuracies, but heh, I loved the show too
Smile

Lynda said

I guess for me was, amongst the ones mentioned on this thread previously, the way they had Katherine Howard behaving. I don’t believe for a minute a Queen of England (however young) would have giggled and flirted and simpered like that. She would have held herself completely differently. Also I know it was just a drama but nobody would have looked so glamorous or sexy all the time!!! The hairstyles were a bit too “now” Smileand there wouldn’t have been as much make-up. But I don’t hold that against the show because I absolutely loved it.Smile

May 27, 2012
10:00 pm
Avatar
Boleyn
Kent.
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2285
Member Since:
January 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I loved it despite it’s inaccuracies. In fact I found it quite by accident when I was looking for something else to do with the Tudor era.
So I was able to download it and get to see it months before it was actually broadcast here in merry olde England, maybe as little as a few days after our American cousins had had it broadcast there. I was hooked the minute I watched the first one.
I never get bored watching them either..

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

May 28, 2012
2:58 am
Avatar
Anyanka
La Belle Province
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2345
Member Since:
November 18, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Janet said

I loved Emily Blunt’s KH. The nude chopping block in The Tudors makes me laugh. It was February and that poor girl would have been darn cold being naked. Laugh

That made me laugh soo hard..even in a modern UK house in feb..prancing aound nude in Feb is for the strong …

It's always bunnies.

May 29, 2012
3:44 pm
Avatar
Boleyn
Kent.
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2285
Member Since:
January 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Anyanka said

Janet said

I loved Emily Blunt’s KH. The nude chopping block in The Tudors makes me laugh. It was February and that poor girl would have been darn cold being naked. Laugh

That made me laugh soo hard..even in a modern UK house in feb..prancing aound nude in Feb is for the strong …

Yeah LOL I would have thought she would have frozen to death instead of having her head chopped off.

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

May 30, 2012
2:25 pm
Avatar
HollyDolly
Texas,USA
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 24
Member Since:
July 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I have no idea whether Wosley did try to kill himself.Maybe he stopped eating because he was very shocked and depressed because of everything he had done for the king,and now he was going to be tried,and imprisioned,and feared he might loose his head.Though if he had lived long enough it’s possible Henry would have kept him a prisioner in the Tower of London,and not have executed him.

As far as the nude chopping block scene that’s rubbish.No wonder young people have no understanding of history ,or have a distorted view of events that occured. Thank goodness I haven’t seen the show, or they would get some nasty grams from me.

May 30, 2012
6:26 pm
Avatar
Boleyn
Kent.
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2285
Member Since:
January 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

HollyDolly said

I have no idea whether Wosley did try to kill himself.Maybe he stopped eating because he was very shocked and depressed because of everything he had done for the king,and now he was going to be tried,and imprisioned,and feared he might loose his head.Though if he had lived long enough it’s possible Henry would have kept him a prisioner in the Tower of London,and not have executed him.

As far as the nude chopping block scene that’s rubbish.No wonder young people have no understanding of history ,or have a distorted view of events that occured. Thank goodness I haven’t seen the show, or they would get some nasty grams from me.

Welcome Holly Dolly.. We are a freindly bunch here with a good sence of humour although not all of us have a dinosaur for a husband LOL.
Intresting post too.
I think that Lard Arse (Henry) would have sentenced Wolsey to death, but whether he would have actually carried the sentence out I think we can surmiss, probably not. Lard Arse I think simply out grew Wolsey influence with or without Anne being his Queen. If Wolsey was still alive when Lard Arse murdered Anne I think Lard arse would have released Wolsey to go and live peacefully and quietly in York or wherever.. But I don’t think he would really be part of Lard arse new world court. Wolsey belonged to the past.
As for the scene where K.H is practising for her death in the nude. Yes I agree it was extremely OTT and quite un-necessary, but by the same token Holly. if you read between the lines. I feel as I’ve mentioned before that this whole scene was put in to relay just how pathetic K.H was and to show just what a tyrant Lard Arse actually was. We have talked about K.H in some detail in quite a few posting on the forums and what you have to understand that K.H was a misguided teenager who tried to fly before she could walk. You will probably be quite annoyed by the way K.H has been portrayed in the Tudors and to be honest I was annoyed, but I’m not knocking it it was how the producers chose to portray her and that’s their opinion and we are entitled to ours just the same. But when you do watch it try to keep an open mind and remember it’s just a soap opera/drama. In some ways I’ve discovered a different K.H than I first had the opinion of when I joined the forum.

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

May 30, 2012
6:53 pm
Avatar
Boleyn
Kent.
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2285
Member Since:
January 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Holly Dolly I forgot to add quite right, about people getting a very disjointed and muddled picture of history when there are mad scenes like this. However we ourselves have a very disjointed and muddled picture on not just Tudor history but History in general, yes we have documents from the time and plenty of books, but from those documents and books we read fiction or non fiction, we can only draw from them our own conclusions of what went on.
Ellie comes out with some real brain buster debates as does Sharon, and I think that both of them and some others will agree that I too come out with some real brain buster debates some of which are so off the latch that I deserve to be either put in the stocks, on the Rack or in the Iron maiden, and sometime all 3 but even so they are all valid points some of which could well be true but there again we all could be barking up the wrong tree at the end of the day.
Unless Stephen Hawking (and with his mind I think he could) invents a time machine so we can all travel back in time and witness first hand what went on, history is all if’s but’s and maybe’s and I can bet your bottom dollar that if we were able to time travel each of us would have a different opinion on what we saw and witnessed. It’s what makes us human to question, re-evaluate and question again..

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

May 16, 2014
3:36 pm
Avatar
Vivian Hester
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 14
Member Since:
May 16, 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

When I first watched the show, I also thought it was real. But then again, the show was the reason for me becoming so intrigued by Tudor times so at first I really believed everything to be true and real, until I started doing some reliable research of my own. I still love the show and also adore Philippa Gregory’s books, but I can now enjoy those things while realizing that it’s fiction. The inaccuracies don’t really bother me, though it sometimes just doesn’t make sense like it feels as if they’re disrespecting history. But what troubles me far more is how people actually believe that the show, the movies and the historical fiction novels are accurate. I did too, at first, but then I went and looked it up. I really think people should keep in mind they’re watching and reading commercial fiction. Plain facts don’t sell. Sex sells. Violence sells. Drama sells. That’s fine, as long as you remember it being not (entirely) true.

Anne Boleyn: just a strong woman with incredible dignity who lived in an era that didn't approve of that.

May 16, 2014
5:22 pm
Avatar
Boleyn
Kent.
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2285
Member Since:
January 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Firstly Vivian welcome to our Boleyn Family home we are a mixed bunch of scallywags who enjoy a good debate and sharing the odd laugh or 2 along the way.
SWMNBN I must admit has written some passable books, but for the most part her books are symptons of a deranged mind. The Virgin lover for instance has been used in sorts of bizarre ways other than reading. I believe another member Janet gave hers to her brothers to use as target practise. I gave mine to my boys (chipmunks) and they soon made quick work of it, what they didn’t shred and use for bedding they pooped on.
Certainly you have the right mindset, that fictional novels are there purely for entertainment value.
Although poetic licence can be carried too far as it was in the Reign series about Mary Queen of Scots..in one word it was CRAP. I watched 15/20 minutes of one episode and nope that was me done.
I must admit I did and still do enjoy the Tudors. it was well thought out and put together and was an enjoyable little saga of sex etc. I even enjoyed the White Queen to a certain degree, although I still want to know what happened to Edward’s pregnant pillow belly? did he give birth to scatter cushions or what? and I certainly thought it was very beyond the pale, about the Bosworth scene when there was snow on the ground.. In August? I don’t think so…..Anne Neville got on my nerves, and Margaret Beaufort was crazy and creepy..and it also seemed a little hurried if that makes sence. I think they could have made a little more of it, if that makes sence…
It is good that when people see and read historical fiction, that they then go and look things up to see if that really happened. It then causes them to think about why that person did what they did that of course leads to finding a site where you can share you thoughts and opinions, which is all good for us and for you as we all get to make new freinds and have something different to talk about.

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

May 17, 2014
12:57 pm
Avatar
Vivian Hester
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 14
Member Since:
May 16, 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Boleyn said

Firstly Vivian welcome to our Boleyn Family home we are a mixed bunch of scallywags who enjoy a good debate and sharing the odd laugh or 2 along the way.
SWMNBN I must admit has written some passable books, but for the most part her books are symptons of a deranged mind. The Virgin lover for instance has been used in sorts of bizarre ways other than reading. I believe another member Janet gave hers to her brothers to use as target practise. I gave mine to my boys (chipmunks) and they soon made quick work of it, what they didn’t shred and use for bedding they pooped on.
Certainly you have the right mindset, that fictional novels are there purely for entertainment value.
Although poetic licence can be carried too far as it was in the Reign series about Mary Queen of Scots..in one word it was CRAP. I watched 15/20 minutes of one episode and nope that was me done.
I must admit I did and still do enjoy the Tudors. it was well thought out and put together and was an enjoyable little saga of sex etc. I even enjoyed the White Queen to a certain degree, although I still want to know what happened to Edward’s pregnant pillow belly? did he give birth to scatter cushions or what? and I certainly thought it was very beyond the pale, about the Bosworth scene when there was snow on the ground.. In August? I don’t think so…..Anne Neville got on my nerves, and Margaret Beaufort was crazy and creepy..and it also seemed a little hurried if that makes sence. I think they could have made a little more of it, if that makes sence…
It is good that when people see and read historical fiction, that they then go and look things up to see if that really happened. It then causes them to think about why that person did what they did that of course leads to finding a site where you can share you thoughts and opinions, which is all good for us and for you as we all get to make new freinds and have something different to talk about.

Thanks for the welcome! I have a question – I have seen you talking about SWMNBN before on this board and I have to say I’m a little confused what it means – I understand it has something to do with Philippa Gregory, but that’s about all I can get out of it. Furthermore, I agree with you on poetic license. I’m writing a novel of historical fiction and am trying to tell the story of Anne from a new, but truthful point of view and I have this perspective: things that people don’t know much about or that aren’t verified or registred, those things I can take and change the way I want. As for everything else I try to be as accurate as possible because I definitely want my story to be believeble for people who know history. I have also watched The White Queen and loved it, though I don’t know much about accuracy because it’s a part of history that I haven’t much looked into. Reign is a tv series I really want to watch sometime, mostly because I plan on writing a novel on Mary in a few years and I wanted to get some inspiration. Thanks to your warning I now know I should not trust too much upon it!

Anne Boleyn: just a strong woman with incredible dignity who lived in an era that didn't approve of that.

May 17, 2014
1:54 pm
Avatar
Olga
Australia
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 766
Member Since:
October 28, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

“She who must not be named” I have always imagined it is a nod to Harry Potter actually. I think typing PG is easier but Boleyn likes to make things interesting Wink

May 17, 2014
2:09 pm
Avatar
Janet
ON Canada
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 153
Member Since:
February 24, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I watched Reign and quite enjoyed it because it was so far out there (historically) that it was easy to watch it as strictly entertainment. Another thing that helped was that although many of the costumes were period, many weren’t. They were kind of period based, but modern at the same time. Other than the fact that Mary did marry Francis, there didn’t seem to be many other actual facts in the show. I don’t think they were trying to be historically accurate, just wanted to make an entertaining series. Smile

May 18, 2014
10:04 am
Avatar
Boleyn
Kent.
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2285
Member Since:
January 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Olga said

“She who must not be named” I have always imagined it is a nod to Harry Potter actually. I think typing PG is easier but Boleyn likes to make things interesting Wink

Well you can’t say I don’t keep you on your toes Olga, LOL :) I must be a glutton for punishment as I am reading yet another SWMNBN book, and I’ve another lined up. Oh well it’s something to read when i’m in the bath.

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

May 18, 2014
6:51 pm
Avatar
Sharon
Binghamton, NY
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2115
Member Since:
February 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I try not to type either of those initials. I won’t read her books, and I won’t watch movies based on her books. I enjoyed The Tudors. I still yell at the TV when I get to certain parts, though. It was very well done and Natalie Dormer was excellent as Anne. I was watching the scene the other day where she is watching her brother and the other men die. Absolutely heartbreaking.
Janet, Hi!
Can’t forget that Reign got Henry and Catherine right. They were married.

May 18, 2014
9:04 pm
Avatar
Boleyn
Kent.
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2285
Member Since:
January 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Yes I agree Natalie Dormer’s heartbreaking sobs as she watched George and her freinds die were very moving. There was also the scene when she looked out of her window almost pleading with her father to save her, and him just walking away. I also love the last scenes as her head is chopped from her body and it flashes back to her childhood when she and George are playing hide and seek with their father, and when he catches her swings her around in his arms. it’s just so sad.. I think of all the films and adaptations i’ve seen of Anne’s death this one rates in the top 3.

Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod

May 22, 2014
7:06 pm
Avatar
Lady Kay
Kentucky
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 6
Member Since:
January 31, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I don’t know if this counts as an inaccuracy, but I found it a bit odd and kinda funny.

I’m currently rewatching the series and I found something interesting in the background. It’s in the scene where Henry is showing Brandon and Sir Anthony ways to prevent the sweating sickness (season 1, episode 7). If you look closely behind Brandon’s head, lo and behold is Richard III’s portrait!

I don’t understand why Henry would keep a portrait of Richard. Maybe to remind him of his father’s success? lol.

"By daily proof you will find me to be both loving and kind."

No permission to create posts
Forum Timezone: Europe/London

Most Users Ever Online: 70

Currently Online:
13 Guest(s)

Top Posters:

Anyanka: 2345

Boleyn: 2285

Sharon: 2115

Bella44: 934

DuchessofBrittany: 847

Mya Elise: 782

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 0

Members: 426038

Moderators: 0

Admins: 1

Forum Stats:

Groups: 1

Forums: 13

Topics: 1679

Posts: 23600

Newest Members:

ashleyro2, franklingo18, HorinadR, estherqw4, enriquebo2, Delaquand

Administrators: Claire: 998