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6:47 pm
February 24, 2010
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Olga,
Katherine Grey could well come off as a selfish, self obsessed chit to some. I can see where that comes from. She was obsessed with her husband and children. It was as if nothing else mattered to her, not even her queen’s wishes. She secretly married Edward Seymour, Ist Duke of Somerset for love. Katherine seemed more interested in being in love and having her babies. I for one, do not think Katherine cared about the crown.
Elizabeth kept Katherine locked up for most of her days. She later did the same to her sister Mary. I would think that some of Elizabeth’s fears and anger stemmed from what happened when Jane was proclaimed queen instead of her sister Mary. The girls’ defiance certainly couldn’t have helped.
Both, Mary and Katherine seemed single-minded and oblivious when it came to Elizabeth. I understand Elizabeth’s anger. If her own family would defy her, what’s to stop others from doing the same.
Katherine Grey was thrown in the Tower for marrying without permission. She was pregnant. She had a son. She couldn’t prove she was married. After Edward gets thrown in the Tower, they have another son. She was in line for the crown and she had sons. Let’s see just how angry Elizabeth can get!
A very good book about these girls is, The Sister’s Who Would Be Queen, by Leanda De Lisle.
8:59 pm
November 18, 2010
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Given how fond Mary was of the 2 younger Grey sisters and Elisabeth’s thought’s of adopting KG as her successior, it seems very strange how KG and later Mary G both looked for their own husbands rather than allowing Elizabeth and her council to provide suitable mates.
I’m sure all 3 Grey daughters were given a high level of education for the time but while Jane seems to have been the more serious of the 3.
Katherine seems to be very impulsive with regard to Edward Seymour. Without really thinking about her position in the line of succession, she went through a secret marriage and she then became pregnant..
She spent many years in the Tower and still not learning her lesson, she mets Edward in secret and becomes pregnant a second time. The fact KG had not one but 2 sons suddenly made her a serious focus for rebellion.
What effect KG’s lack of judgement had on MG is debatable. Did Mg follow her mother or sister in choosing her husband? Certainly the marriage had echos of Frances Brandon’s marrriage to the lower ranked Adrian Stokes but the secrecy of her wedding to Thomas Keyes just weeks before Mary QoS to Darnley must have shocked Elizabth to the core.
I agree with Sharon about the de Lisle book. It’s a good read.
It's always bunnies.
9:45 pm
January 3, 2012
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Anyanka.. I think, you mean M.G wedding to Thomas Keyes. Not Frances Brandon as it looks like to me at least..
Adrian Stokes outlived Frances Brandon, by many years..
Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod
11:10 pm
November 18, 2010
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Anyanka said
What effect KG’s lack of judgement had on MG is debatable.
Did Mg follow her mother or sister in choosing her husband?
Certainly the marriage had echos of Frances Brandon’s marrriage to the lower ranked Adrian Stokes but the secrecy of her (MG’s) wedding to Thomas Keyes just weeks before Mary QoS to Darnley must have shocked Elizabeth to the core.
added name to make my meaning more clear.
It's always bunnies.
11:34 pm
November 18, 2010
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Boleyn said
Anyanka.. I think, you mean M.G wedding to Thomas Keyes. Not Frances Brandon as it looks like to me at least..
Adrian Stokes outlived Frances Brandon, by many years..
Indeed Mary G spent some time at Adrian Stokes’s home with his second wife, the former Lady Throckmorton, after Mary’s release from capitivy in the charge of Sir Thomas Gresham.
It's always bunnies.
8:26 am
October 28, 2011
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Okay thanks guys. Seems Weir wasn’t being that harsh on her then. I do have that book Sharon, I was going to do a block of reading (I like to read two or three on the same families/people in a row) as soon as I get Ive’s book on Jane.
I also wasn’t sure how serious a threat to the throne Katherine was, in this fictional account she converts to Catholicism to please Mary Tudor, then sticks to it while the Spanish are courting her. She seems pretty much obsessed, with both husbands (it covers her non-consummated first marriage too) in being in love and she comes off as a bit frivolous.
Mary is not really mentioned much in this book, I have read about her here and there and I was pretty shocked to see she married a gatekeeper (?) Stokes also comes off as a bit of an accessory of Francis Brandon’s as well, it’s not overly-negative but really I prefer Susan Higginbotham’s version of their marriage.
1:23 pm
January 3, 2012
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Olga M.G was described by some as being a humpbacked dwarf, and very plain in looks. I’m not to sure about this so please don’t slam me, but I think given the circumstances of her appearence Frances Brandon had trouble in finding a suitable candidate to marry her. Thomas Keyes obvisiously must have looked beyond MG’s appearence and liked what he saw underneath, and married her.
I also think they may have been a little bit of jealously on Elizabeth’s part to do with the Grey sisters, they were young and yes they were next in line to the throne and she would have known that, basically Elizabeth wanted no rival claiment around during her reign. She was determined not to allow the Grey sisters to marry without her seal of approval and she wouldn’t give it, the reason being that if they married and had children if they were boys they would be the threat not Katherine or Mary.
Woman rulers was still in it’s infancy and there were many who still believed that a woman’s place was to have babies not to rule a country.
When Katherine married Edward Seymour the mucky stuff hit the fan espcially as K.G had not 1 son but 2. The boy’s were seen as a very real threat to Elizabeth, hence the reason why Elizabeth went off the deep end like she did and declared the marriage between K.G and E.S null and void and her children by him bastards.
Did Elizabeth actually name James 6th her heir on her deathbed? It does seem strange that when she knew that her time was almost up that she didn’t name the eldest Seymour/Grey child her heir. It would only take a rubber stamp to say they were legitimate and they should inherit after her death, and unknown Scottish king to take the throne when she died was a gamble on her part. Surely I would have thought that her people would want a king that was born and bred on English soil? Makes me think that by allowing James to rule after her, was her way of apoligizing to her Catholic subjects for chopping off MQS head.
Semper Fidelis, quod sum quod
2:47 pm
October 28, 2011
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I don’t know Bo, James had as good a claim as any, and even if Elizabeth had declared the Grey offspring legitimate there would have been a stigma, like she suffered herself. I think she made that choice, I know there’s some conspiracy theories but I still believe it was her choice.
Now I’ve only read about Mary being a hunchback in fictional accounts, she may well have been, but she was definitely tiny from what I have read in non-fiction. I read something about people making remarks about the tiniest person at court marrying the largest (he was apparently very tall)
I wouldn’t call Elizabeth jealous of the Grey’s, threatened maybe, but the Tudors never had a stable throne because they came through an illegitimate line, and on top of that Henry made his two daughters illegitimate, making matters even more difficult for her. Henry VII and Henry VIII both executed Plantagenets who had a claim to the throne, Mary was forced (that’s what I think anyway) to execute Jane Grey. Elizabeth had to execute Mary of Scots. I imagine it was a relief for Elizabeth when Katherine died, sad as the whole affair is.
